![]() Seems way more sensible than speculating on the accident. If you're seriously this concerned about all the details, why not email Andy and Bonnie Armstrong (their information is the NSS members manual)? They are two of the most experienced cave rescuers in the United States and they were a part of his rescue. There's an entire accident report in the 2009 to 2010 American Caving Accidents book, written by the rescuers who were on-site, about all of this. To clarify I don’t think anyone was to blame and this was quite possibly the most difficult cave rescue ever attempted in the US.ĭo you think there were any mistakes made or any chance he could have been pulled out and saved? What seems to vary in reports is how far they were able to pull him when the pulley system and or rope failed - there’s discrepancy about that too. Also, some sources say they spent hours praying with him which wasted some valuable time. I’ve been trying to find photos or video of the actual spot and I’ve only found two that look legit.ĭo you think there were any mistakes made or any chance he could have been pulled out and saved? Personally I think the biggest mistake was him and his brother trying to reposition him which seems to have caused him to get even more stuck. And I think I read some people on a caving forum saying there may have been other passages off-shooting from known passages. I too am obsessed! I’ve heard that there were multiple tight passages in the cave, one being called “Scout Eater” - how apropos. I wonder what he thought he’d see on the other side. The passage he crawled through wasn’t worn away at all since few had attempted it. Every cave I’ve been in has been unfortunately marked by graffiti or ropes but it does help you find your way. It’s a reminder that something so simple could be so fatal. Was he getting cocky and exploring? Trying to map uncharted territory? Or did he honestly think he was in the Birth Canal? ![]() Or maybe he was in a passage that nobody had ever crawled through. People say he thought he was in the Birth Canal but was actually in Ed’s Push. We knew where we were and had done it several times. The rock was worn away by people crawling over it over decades. Everything we did was well charted territory. Coming out the other side of a long crawl feels good. I grew up caving with my dad and my brother and did many tight squeezes where you had to take the backpack off. I, like many other Redditors have become obsessed with the details of this unfortunate story. Hey y’all - first of all Rest In Peace John Jones If there's one takeaway from the rescue itself, it's "don't rely on natural anchors and just bolt that shiiiiit." □ or the people who fall off the rim of the Grand Canyon while trying to take a photo over the edge. Unfortunately, there are derpy people out there who have literally no sense of their own mortality- just look at any Yellowstone death caused by some idiot walking across a geyser field. Based on all accounts, the dude was not a knowledgeable caver and he completely lacked judgement about his own physical size / abilities. To answer your questions an "experienced" Caver: the event was a rare occasion of major "wtf, why would he even attempt to do that" accumulated badly enough to kill someone. ![]() Meanwhile, every time someone twists a damn ankle in a cave or whatever it is nearly headline news and with all sorts of wild speculations and incorrect statements. Most other potentially hazardous hobbies (skiing, backcountry hiking, mountain biking, etc) don't catch the negative publicity that caving gets any time someone gets themselves maimed or killed from hitting a tree or falling down a ravine or whatever. Please understand how grinding it is for us to constantly hear about each jackass who gets themselves hurt or killed. :/ I didn't mean it to come across harshly at you. The write-ups from non-cavers are often ridiculously wrong or poorly stated. Sorry, I meant like perpetuating what news reports and non-rescuers claimed happen. r/alpinism Take hiking to the high slopes Please join the NSS, find your local grotto (cave club) to learn caving and cave locations.įind a caving group in your own country: International Union of Speleology
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